Being a Beginner

[olivermoss]

I wanted to post about a comic I saw suddenly go across my screen a bunch. Some of the people who I know posted it have since deleted it. I guess they got pushback? Anyway, since this was all over my feeds and now people have deleted my need to rant is slightly less, but I am going to do it anyway.


I guess I need to describe the comic since everyone who I can remember posting has deleted and I can't grab a copy of the image. A newbie asks someone how to get started. The person says "just do the thing". The newbie is like 'but how do I start?' The person makes like wide crazy eyes, shoves a pencil in their hand, pushes the hand onto paper and is like 'just do it and keep doing it, that's it'.

This is terrible advice. If you are an established creator on social media I get being annoyed at people asking for help. Telling people to 'just grind more' when they are trying to improve is toxic bullshit. Don't act like they are doing it wrong by even asking. That is my problem with the comic. It implies that trying to figure out how to have a strong start isn't the right move. It implies that you just need to grind. Some of the people I saw repost that comic have a formal education in their artistic field. I don't want to hear people with degrees saying 'grind more'.

Obviously, I am peeved at more just this comic. There is this 'rugged individualism' approach to becoming a creator that a lot of people put out there even if it's at odds with their personal path to where they are.

I hate it when people with BFA degrees or who got personally mentored by a professional in the field is like 'Put in your ten thousand hours. That's it. That's what people don't get.' Yes, you need to put in the time but that's not all there is to it. They are refusing to acknowledge the help they got and are acting like it's all them, they created themselves. Having started out in writing by collabing with a full time working author didn't help them or anything. They didn't have a step up due to social connections, that's crazy talk.

I've been asked how to get serious/better at photography a few times. It's only happened extremely rarely, but it has happened. My usual answer is that "Oof, that's too open ended can you narrow it down?" The one time I did give detailed constructive critique of someone's work they didn't take any of it on board and told me all about the compliments they've gotten from friends and family. I basically wasted a bunch of my energy. They didn't want help, they wanted attention and compliments. I get it, trying to engage and help someone often isn't worth the time. But they can just ignore the asks or have a stock reply that points to a good resource.

Also, to be brutally honest, most of the times I've had people ask why their photos aren't turning out the way they expect the answer is one they really don't want to hear. Their lens is dirty. Even dust not visible in the shot fucks with the focus and sensor. No one wants to be told it's a cleaning problem, trust me. So yeah, asks can be awkward.

That was only partially a tangent. That I can diagnose focus problems as a cleaning issue like that at a glance has to do with my level of experience. Obviously, getting good at anything involves a massive time commitment, but you need to make sure you use that time well.

* People need to make massive time commitments to progress at any art form
* People need to know how to start or level up their game or they will wind up spinning their wheels
^ Both of the above statements are true and not in conflict with each other.

So much stuff can trip up beginners. Advertising can be a big one. Some people have unrealistic ideas of what their gear can do. In camera ads there is no rule that says that the picture in the ad has to be taken with that camera. glares in Samsung's direction. One reason why my cell phone shots are good is that I can sit here and ramble about the sensor, lens and software differences between a cell phone and IC camera. Also, I know that Samsung and Huawei are lying liars that lie when it comes to advertising what their gear can do. Apple may be honest as far as I know, but their ads only shows the camera's strengths and not it's weaknesses. I will never think it's a ME problem that I can't do amazing portraits on a phone. I know certain companies are licensing dSLR photos for their ads. (Caught red handed, BTW, this isn't just me being an armchair expert.) Due to my knowledge and experience I know how to maximize what my camera phone can do and I don't waste my time or fruitlessly grind trying to do what it can't. Grinding photography with a camera phone and literally impossible expectations created by ads would be terrible, lead to wasted time and feeling inept.

Spending massive amounts of time is key. Look at my Photography tag. There is a lot there. (There would be more but I keep forgetting to tag my posts.) The amount of time I've spent shooting, editing, trying techniques, making up challenges for myself, organizing, reading, learning, researching shoot locations, etc ... it's a LOT. I did some math, and I don't have that allegedly magic 10,000 hours yet tho. In the 13 years since I got my Pen 1, I'd have had to spend 15 hours a week every single week. Yet people say 'hit your 10,000 hours, that's it.' The people I follow on social media who have creative careers, grinding 10,000 hours wasn't how they get there. Do I wish I'd spend 15 hours a week for the past 13 years? Yeah, of course. My folders would be far more bountiful. But no one gets anywhere by just grinding. If I'd had a stronger start rather than being made fun of for being an m43 shooter every time I posted on a photography forum I'd be much better off. I shot for years before I first read a textbook on composition or found a good non-bullshit youtuber to follow. The hours I put in where more effective once I had a handle on better self-teaching and also creating self-challenges.

For more context, here are some images from a folder I have labeled 'Photobucket Downloads'. These images are from a bygone era:









These are oooold pictures. Maybe circa 2008? I've been going out of my way to shoot weird shit for ages. I got a lot more serious and regular about doing photography a few years ago, but in these pictures I can clearly see the seeds of my current style: weird, creepy, nerdy, mossy, etc. I've been honing my eye for ages. I would not be where I am without all that experience. But I'd also be a thousand times better off if I'd had a resource like Robin Wong's videos starting out.

But I guess everyone I follow deleting that damn tweet validates my viewpoint. I wish I'd seen the threads, though.

(* I love talking photography. I know I sound very on my high horse in that paragraph. I don't mean to sound more leet than I really am. I've just gotten some totally cold 'how do I get better?' asks from people who want to be told one weird trick and not that they need to learn subject isolation. I am in a weird space with photography where I've done paid work ... but also had people flip out that a photog of my level has made money at it.

Speaking of which I need to get back to writing/pitching articles. Even if I can't sell them I can put them on my website as more content. On my last walk, I took some pictures for a found art article I've been meaning to write. Composition, interacting with the artists, ethical and legal considerations of someone else's work being the clear and present subject of your photo, etc. Are my found art photos art in and of themselves or am I a documentarian?)

Comments

[bleodswean]

I so agree with this. In most cases, people don't ask unless they are looking for an answer or some answers. Of course, there are those who ask because they are poised to leap in with all the things they already know...*shrug* It takes nothing away from those who are already established to offer a hand up.

[olivermoss]

Yeah, and it's fine to have a stock answer like 'go read these books' or just not engage. But acting like information about how to put your work out there, good beginner exercises, pitfalls ect isn't important is just nuts.

[bleodswean]

It's an internet thing, imo. I had to apprentice back before the internet because there was simply no other way to learn the trade I was desperate to learn. I could only get so far by reading and there was no way I was going to jump in without some guidance. But online...everyone is so desirous of showing this really polished hard side of themselves, and their art just becomes an extension of that desire. It's misleading to suggest that "grinding harder" (I love that) is the one true path. For some, sure, I guess that's absolutely possible. But if that were universal...we wouldn't have schools. LOL. Bring apprenticing back!

[olivermoss]

Yeah, they want to show themselves as very polished and downplay any privileges. And I get that the modern era level of access to writers and stuff can create a lot of pressure on them. But that's not a way to deal with it!

I mean, I'm self taught but I had to learn how to teach myself effectively. Blindly grinding wouldn't have gotten me anywhere. A lot of the people asking are trying to learn how to self-teach.

[ihavenoarms]

nice photos

[olivermoss]

Thanks!

[mistressofmuses]

YES TO THIS. I have seen that comic several times, and it bugs the hell out of me every time.

Look, I'm not a pro at any type of art, by any stretch. I write more than anything else, but that's still hobby stuff. Same with my cell phone hiking photos, or my occasional drawing, or model painting or whatever. I do arty things because I like to, and while I do try to improve at them, I'm okay with that progress being slow.

Yes, "just start" is part of learning to do something well. I also know people who are so worried about "how to start" that they spend weeks and months and years and forever trying to get ready to do the thing and never actually doing it, because they get paralyzed. And so in that case "hey, at some point you have to just start!" may be useful advice.


BUT. I hate "JUST START!" being treated as the be-all, end-all of "what it takes." And hearing "just start! just do it! there's nothing else to it! practice more!" from people who HAVE had formal training and mentorship and the ability to get a degree in the field and therefore the education to have a solid background in technique and theory before they even had to truly start "just doing it"... is damn infuriating.

[olivermoss]

It really is. It's like they are trying to act like it's all them, not their training or connections. Even though I am a self-taught photographer, I had to learn how to effectively teach myself.

I think different mediums have different pitfalls. I thought that I had to get good on sketch paper before I could graduate to good paper, but everything I was trying to do doesn't work on sketch paper. Grinding did not work there. With photography, taking a few hundred pictures can be a good very first step. But after that it's good to start learning technique and knowing things. With writing and music you need to be careful about forming bad habits and it's good to figure out a proper start.

You need to put in the hours and not get hung up on how to start, but also, yeah, you need to make sure your time is being effectively spent.

[mistressofmuses]

For real! It is a very "bootstraps-y" mentality, and it has the same vibe as those "how I became a millionaire at 25" articles about trust-fund kids who went to college paid for by their parents, and were given a house as a wedding gift by their parents, and started working at their parents' company for a six-figure salary right after graduation, and then say "oh, it's so easy to save money! I work really hard! I only eat out twice a week! I haven't bought a new car in four years!"

Absolutely right, though. You need to have the base knowledge to make your practice worthwhile. Practice and "just doing it" WILL ultimately be part of it, of course. But if you're using the wrong materials, no amount of "JUST KEEP PRACTICING" will overcome that. And if you're looking to upgrade your skill level, there is always more to it than practicing alone. Demanding that every new artist reinvent every technique used in their field is stupid and condescending as hell.

Practicing hundreds of hours doing something WRONG, or in a way that is futile for what your goal is, isn't going to do you any favors.

[olivermoss]

The 'just keep grinding' mentality had really messed up my progress on a lot of things. It is very bootstrappy and treats advantages like they aren't real or meaningful. It was hard to not go on long tangents about that during the post. Also, with any art form you need to find a way to safely have an audience to see if you are communicating your ideas clearly. You need a space to safely fail. (AKA ask me why I have more than one Ao3 profile and why I should have gotten socks sooner.)

There is no replacement for lots and lots of experience. Some things are actually hard to teach, but you still need guidance. And a lot of self teaching is figuring out how to structure your own learning. And it's going to vary by medium what balance you need and if you should learn a few things first (good posture for music for avoid bad habits) or if the first step is doing the thing a bit to see where you are (like photography. Taking 100 pics and then analyzing them is a good first step)

[mistressofmuses]

Same here. "Do this with no guidance or constructive feedback until suddenly you're good" isn't a winning prospect.

That's a good point about the safe audience, too. I hadn't really thought about it, but yeah, absolutely. Pseuds and socks and things are a great safety net if you're just getting into something, and wanting to see how it feels without so much risk to yourself.

And that's exactly it, I think. Not EVERYTHING can be taught, because without practice it doesn't matter how much theory you have. But that doesn't mean that the theory and the technique tutorials and the explanations of why certain things work etc. are suddenly worthless. It takes both. (And learning how to learn is a big step! As is how to sort out bad advice from worthwhile.)

[olivermoss]

I read Stephen King's On Writing, which is apparently one of the standard books to read. (Okay, I read part of it. It's too much like a disjointed autobiography and I can't stay engaged.) He talked about sending his work out again and again even when he was pretty young. He was lucky. Most people would have wound up on a 'don't bother reading' slush pile. A lot of authors come up writing fanfic, but, well, look at twitter. Having burnable aliases is a good strat. Putting yourself out there needs to be balanced with protecting yourself. I mean, also look at that recent Isabel Fall stuff.

I think writing in particular, and it was writers who were sharing than damn comic, has a lot of pitfalls. From 90% of Tumblr misunderstanding standard writing advice to the sheer hell that is the YA scene. Photography ... well there are dangers but they have more to do with common sense or social skills than photography skill.

A practice/learning balance is good. Spending time doing the thing helps you figure out whose advice is good and who shouldn't be listened to. It's easier to have actual conversations about like dialogue structure with people who've done it, rather than have read a dozen tumblr posts about said tags.

Also, I should really get a 3rd Ao3 for just like shit posting. Fling some random stuff against the wall and see what sticks.

[mistressofmuses]

I've read... parts of On Writing. I have certainly always heard that it is THE book for aspiring writers, but never managed to make it all the way through, heh.
There's a LOT of outdated info out there about "how to make it." Kind of like the frustrating advice from older family or the like for finding a job: "go into the place you want to work and demand to speak to the manager and give them your resume!" OR that could get be blacklisted immediately because NO PLACE HIRES THAT WAY.

Oh god, the Isabel Fall stuff is horrifying. There absolutely HAS to be some amount of protecting yourself when you put your work and by extension yourself out there. The coordinated harassment campaigns that get waged over the PETTIEST shit are genuinely DANGEROUS in a lot of cases.

Writing is certainly the artistic field I'm most familiar with, and for a brief period I tried to be at least slightly engaged with the "writblr" community, though never really stuck with it. But seriously, there is a LOT of lousy advice out there, or advice that could have been okay if it wasn't wrapped in twelve layers of bad takes. (And much like tumblr is prone to in general: a post by someone who speaks authoritatively enough, and uses the right buzzwords, or just the right posting style can be held up as OBJECTIVE TRUTH... regardless of the fact that the post itself is just about subjective preference.

I don't know a lot about more organized photography communities or anything, but I can absolutely see there being issues of social skill and stuff, more so than some mediums. And also people having to figure out what their equipment is capable of or what's a worthy investment from that perspective.

I definitely plan on getting at least one additional AO3 account. Right now I only have the one, but can see the utility in having one that's not connected to any of my other presences online. Again, having watched friends and acquaintances getting eviscerated for writing a "problematic" trope or ship or whatever has made me possibly overly cautious, and it would be nice not to worry so much.

[olivermoss]

Getting a second account was such a relief. But now I need a third just for messing around. Honestly, I recommend it so much.

Writblr gives bad advice and takes it as a personal attack when you challenge it. It's a mess.

On Photog forums the main problems are gear obsession, gear addiction, shitting on people with weaker gear and attacking anyone who is anything less than a Nat Geo full timer with a master's degree is they DARE call themselves pro. Saying you are a Photographer is sacred and how dare a ... a filthy instagrammer claim such a thing.

... no I don't have lots of built up stress from dealing with photo communities or any issues what so ever. This is part of why I walk so much. 'talk less, shoot more' is advice I've taken very much to heart.

They are good at newbie advice, though. Just as long as everyone knows their place and knows their gear is bad and they should feel bad about it.

Social skills are key for many types of photography. I've tossed out a bunch of photogs from events who burned bridges with the event hard. Also, like, I take pictures of people's yard and zoom in on cats in yards. Sometimes the owners have question. Wanna do the most profitable photography types? It's almost all social skills.

[mistressofmuses]

I think I'm sold on doing it. It sounds quite freeing, really, to be able to write with no connection to the rest of what you do.

Writeblr is the hottest of messes, ugh. There are some great, really creative people, and I have absolutely found some great "how to combat this specific issue" advice there. But there is a whole lot of shitty advice (or advice that's only applicable for some things) treated as gospel and... eesh.

I'm imagining it as similar to some music gear snobs, too. Ugh, super gatekeepy and snooty, lol. I'm glad they can be helpful to someone starting out... as long as they don't get above their station, ugh.

Lol, I can't imagine WHY you would have pent up stress relating to those attitudes, haha.

Oh absolutely. Photography, unless you're exclusively shooting in untouched wilderness on public lands that you can access easily yet require no permits for, is going to require a lot more interaction than some kinds of art. I'm not surprised there are photographers that screw themselves by being nuisances or refusing to follow rules, etc.

[olivermoss]

There is this story passed around about some kid who become a famous sports photographer. He bluffed/grifted his was into the press boxes starting as a young teenager. Every photog takes the wrong lesson from this. I've tossed photogs from events for blustering their way into a space to get better/exclusive photos. They think 'be bold, trespass, steal'. In reality, it was excellent social skills.

Tripods ... tripods in the spaces put aside for wheelchairs. Like there is a chance in hell I'd let that stand. No shot is worth burning bridges.

Also the best routes to monetizing photography is teaching, family portraits, boudoir photography, etc. All very social skills based.

[mistressofmuses]

Oh geez, that doesn't surprise me in the slightest that people would come away with the exact wrong message from a story like that. Grifting is all about the social skill behind it!

And it also doesn't surprise me that dickwads would decide that wheelchair access areas would be acceptable areas for them to put their shit. Ugh. Glad you've tossed people for that, as you should!

[olivermoss]

Photographers are the worst. They really are.